| The plane over the Etihad on 15:48 - Jun 23 with 1555 views | Sirjohnalot |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:29 - Jun 23 by Lohengrin |
Trouble is, Leon, when John said that white folk aren’t targeted that’s his experience. That’s mine too and probably yours but Fieryjack, who leans about as far left as it’s possible to get without falling over, says that has been his experience of modern day Bradford I’m inclined to believe him. Are you? |
I accept this without reservation, it’s equally as disgusting and abhorrent. There’s always going to be exceptions that prove the rule, my point was as an overall picture, white people, being in the majority normally, do not suffer the same.
May I ask FJ if his awful experiences are limited to a small area as opposed to more widespread ? That’s the difference |  | |  |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:49 - Jun 23 with 1550 views | Lohengrin |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:44 - Jun 23 by Darran |
I don’t think Chad and Lisa like each other. |
I like them both, and I’m the final arbiter.
So there.
Besides, squabbling on here isn’t the real world, there’s no connection at all. Look at me and Clase, we got on in person like a house on fire, those two would be no different I’m sure. |  |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| The plane over the Etihad on 15:54 - Jun 23 with 1546 views | Lohengrin |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:48 - Jun 23 by Sirjohnalot |
I accept this without reservation, it’s equally as disgusting and abhorrent. There’s always going to be exceptions that prove the rule, my point was as an overall picture, white people, being in the majority normally, do not suffer the same.
May I ask FJ if his awful experiences are limited to a small area as opposed to more widespread ? That’s the difference |
Where we are not in the majority roles tend to flip and there’s no dog bites with quite the enthusiasm of the under dog. | |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| The plane over the Etihad on 15:56 - Jun 23 with 1544 views | londonlisa2001 |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:41 - Jun 23 by chad |
Oh Lisa you do make me smile, you falsely accuse me of straw man then you come up with this. You should get a job as a projectionist.
‘White supremacists are not a protected group under the law
Where did I ever suggest they were Lisa? Or even mention White Supremacists?
‘But your analogy between overt racists and gay people is charming
Never made any such analogy Lisa, just gave 2 examples of why the main legal point K made was inaccurate, which it clearly is, as in response to the OP, K said:
“it is not a matter of whether or not any laws have been broken, Turf Moor is a private premises so Burnley FC can ban anyone they like for whatever reasons they choose, the same as the owners of any private premises anywhere in the country. It is entirely up to them.”
That is a general rule K was presenting, and that was incorrect, and that is what I pointed out. I thought we might like to base our deliberations on facts rather than Lisalaw.
Still interesting to know you consider people wanting to base opinions on facts, thick as mince. Thank goodness we have self adjudged, superior people like you, to keep us in our place. You really should book yourself on an equality seminar. |
Really.? You generally make me roll my eyes.
Everyone can read what you wrote - I’m not repeating myself. |  | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:59 - Jun 23 with 1533 views | Lohengrin |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:46 - Jun 23 by londonlisa2001 |
Your descent from reasoned argument, however repugnant, into ill-informed drivel is sad to see. I mean that quite genuinely. |
Good luck on the new path you’re setting. I mean that genuinely too, you’ll need it.  | |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| The plane over the Etihad on 16:04 - Jun 23 with 1525 views | londonlisa2001 |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:54 - Jun 23 by Lohengrin |
Where we are not in the majority roles tend to flip and there’s no dog bites with quite the enthusiasm of the under dog. |
As I said in the earlier post, equating discrimination by individuals or a group of individuals with systemic discrimination is completely missing the point.
All discrimination is wrong and abhorrent.
But inbuilt discrimination within the very structures of society are a totally different matter. No white person anywhere in the UK suffers that. The underdog is still the underdog wherever you may live in this country. | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:07 - Jun 23 with 1520 views | londonlisa2001 |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:59 - Jun 23 by Lohengrin |
Good luck on the new path you’re setting. I mean that genuinely too, you’ll need it. |
I’m not setting any new path.
Your angle of sight is just changing as you get sucked in by nonsense. When you start quoting, as you have in the last few days, bullsh*t propaganda straight from the Putin bot farm, you need to take a breath and reassess. | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad (n/t) on 16:12 - Jun 23 with 1501 views | chad |
| The plane over the Etihad on 14:21 - Jun 23 by Sirjohnalot |
White people were not killed due to their colour, had they been black, Indian, Asian, or any other colour who just happened to get in his way, they’d have been killed.
White people are not targeted due to their colour, white people are not (as someone I witnessed in a trial I did last year) complained about by a member of the jury in a note passed to the judge as asked to leave the public gallery when dressed in a suit as they thought they were gang members and intimidating the jury (they were on work experience in a Barrister’s chambers). White people are not racially abused in the street. White people are not targeted by idiots in the US, including the President, they do not have the equivalent of the KKK still marching through streets, they do not have far right idiots in this country, racially abusing them, they do not have statues in Bristol celebrating known slave masters.
As much as I love Fawlty Towers they don’t have characters like the Major using racially abusive words and still being shown today.
I live in Manchester, when the bomb went off and the slogan ‘I 💔 Manchester’ and ‘Manchester together’ was prominent, no one said ‘what about Leeds ?’ When Boston happened and we had ‘Boston Strong’, no one said ‘What about Chicago ?
It’s the same argument that when gay pride marches happening, people demand ‘straight pride’. It’s nonsense. No one is saying that white lives don’t also matter, but until black people obtain equivalence, it will still be necessary. |
Well Sir J it seems your post is beyond reproach, the vox pop. However Loh has already pointed out one very obvious flaw. White people are targeted due to their colour.
Whilst of course the underlying issue is very real, I would also make the following comments...
Your initial point how could you possifbly know that. You are surely claiming knowledge that you cannot possibly own.
And as far as the US, Should we rip this country apart because of things that happened there. Or deal with our own problems, without dismantling our social fabric
Supporting geographic areas that have suffered atrocities is different from trying to heal internal racial division with division. [Post edited 23 Jun 2020 16:38]
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| The plane over the Etihad on 16:17 - Jun 23 with 1489 views | chad |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:56 - Jun 23 by londonlisa2001 |
Really.? You generally make me roll my eyes.
Everyone can read what you wrote - I’m not repeating myself. |
Of course they can read what I wrote, and your false allegations | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:18 - Jun 23 with 1484 views | Lohengrin |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:04 - Jun 23 by londonlisa2001 |
As I said in the earlier post, equating discrimination by individuals or a group of individuals with systemic discrimination is completely missing the point.
All discrimination is wrong and abhorrent.
But inbuilt discrimination within the very structures of society are a totally different matter. No white person anywhere in the UK suffers that. The underdog is still the underdog wherever you may live in this country. |
” But inbuilt discrimination within the very structures of society are a totally different matter. No white person anywhere in the UK suffers that.”
When young working class kids from Trallwn and Penlan have work and university quotas set aside for them get back to me and we can examine your proposition. | |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| The plane over the Etihad on 16:20 - Jun 23 with 1480 views | Treforys_Jack |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:43 - Jun 23 by londonlisa2001 |
I have no disdain for SwanseaSo it hasn’t been showing in the slightest.
I love Swansea, it’s the best city on the planet in my view.
Stop twisting what I’m saying. Your response shows exactly why it’s impossible to have a proper discussion. I didn’t say I’m ashamed of Swansea I said I’m ashamed that some of the people on here are from Swansea. The majority of people on here seem to share my view. |
No worries, have a good day. |  | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:22 - Jun 23 with 1471 views | chad |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:04 - Jun 23 by londonlisa2001 |
As I said in the earlier post, equating discrimination by individuals or a group of individuals with systemic discrimination is completely missing the point.
All discrimination is wrong and abhorrent.
But inbuilt discrimination within the very structures of society are a totally different matter. No white person anywhere in the UK suffers that. The underdog is still the underdog wherever you may live in this country. |
There you go with your absolutes,
I think a few women may disagree with you there Lisa, especially the sex and domestic slaves. And a few other abused girls. | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:22 - Jun 23 with 1471 views | NotLoyal |
| The plane over the Etihad on 14:08 - Jun 23 by ymaohyd |
I must be missing something about this WLM banner issue.
I haven't been racist towards anyone in my life, when going to Uni most of my friends were black or from other ethnic minority backgrounds.
Years ago when in Cardiff, I helped a black woman carry some bags to her car when it was piss+ng down, she turned around and said that it was the kindest thing anyone had done for her the years that she had lived in Cardiff, a lovely comment that I still think about now.
Not saying this banner was right but in the week when more white people have been killed by another asylum seeking nut job, don't really get the outpouring of self disgust. |
Maybe you answered your own question, you actually recall the black woman, it’s not at all that you are racist it’s that you remember the situation compared to all the other people I’m sure you remember and helped throughout your life.
I think it’s a matter of truth that when we see a black person, or any other ethnic minority we immediately profile them unconsciously as what we see. We recall them as per their ethnic origin, which isn’t something we do to people of our own colour ( if you are white )
Although I doubt even the protestors know what they are shouting about if they had to explain it. |  |
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| The plane over the Etihad on 16:30 - Jun 23 with 1449 views | Nortbankboy |
| The plane over the Etihad on 23:15 - Jun 22 by Joe_bradshaw |
White Lives Matter is a Nazi organisation of white supremacists in the United States. |
Thank God we haven't got fans like that.
It would so embarrassing | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:32 - Jun 23 with 1448 views | Treforys_Jack |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:22 - Jun 23 by NotLoyal |
Maybe you answered your own question, you actually recall the black woman, it’s not at all that you are racist it’s that you remember the situation compared to all the other people I’m sure you remember and helped throughout your life.
I think it’s a matter of truth that when we see a black person, or any other ethnic minority we immediately profile them unconsciously as what we see. We recall them as per their ethnic origin, which isn’t something we do to people of our own colour ( if you are white )
Although I doubt even the protestors know what they are shouting about if they had to explain it. |
Fantastic post  | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:52 - Jun 23 with 1414 views | Humpty |
| The plane over the Etihad on 14:21 - Jun 23 by Sirjohnalot |
White people were not killed due to their colour, had they been black, Indian, Asian, or any other colour who just happened to get in his way, they’d have been killed.
White people are not targeted due to their colour, white people are not (as someone I witnessed in a trial I did last year) complained about by a member of the jury in a note passed to the judge as asked to leave the public gallery when dressed in a suit as they thought they were gang members and intimidating the jury (they were on work experience in a Barrister’s chambers). White people are not racially abused in the street. White people are not targeted by idiots in the US, including the President, they do not have the equivalent of the KKK still marching through streets, they do not have far right idiots in this country, racially abusing them, they do not have statues in Bristol celebrating known slave masters.
As much as I love Fawlty Towers they don’t have characters like the Major using racially abusive words and still being shown today.
I live in Manchester, when the bomb went off and the slogan ‘I 💔 Manchester’ and ‘Manchester together’ was prominent, no one said ‘what about Leeds ?’ When Boston happened and we had ‘Boston Strong’, no one said ‘What about Chicago ?
It’s the same argument that when gay pride marches happening, people demand ‘straight pride’. It’s nonsense. No one is saying that white lives don’t also matter, but until black people obtain equivalence, it will still be necessary. |
Excellent post but wasted unfortunately.
The people who think shouting white lives matter is ok are either too thick to realise why it's wrong or understand fully but want to anyway. [Post edited 23 Jun 2020 16:56]
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| The plane over the Etihad on 16:53 - Jun 23 with 1417 views | londonlisa2001 |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:18 - Jun 23 by Lohengrin |
” But inbuilt discrimination within the very structures of society are a totally different matter. No white person anywhere in the UK suffers that.”
When young working class kids from Trallwn and Penlan have work and university quotas set aside for them get back to me and we can examine your proposition. |
University quotas:
University of Oxford Annual Admissions Report May 2020
“Those from the most deprived areas have increased from 8.6% to 12.2% and those from areas with low progressions rates to university from 10.8% to 14%.
In an effort to accelerate the pace of change, last year we announced three initiatives to help us to realize our ambition of ensuring that in four years’ time 25% of British undergraduates admitted to Oxford would be from low-income backgrounds. We increased the size of our UNIQ Summer School by 50%, to 1,350 students, last summer. The first cohort of students admitted via our Opportunity Oxford bridging programme will begin this September, and we will begin the roll-out of Foundation Oxford next year. It is too soon to see the impact of these initiatives on the figures presented here.“
Work Quotas:
“ Based on the review’s findings, the BBC’s Executive Board has accepted a range of recommendations that are designed to further increase the socio-economic diversity of the BBC workforce, and are looking into the viability of introducing a career mobility programme throughout the BBC to promote high performing talent. Other recommendations include:
Aiming to provide at least 70 percent of places on apprenticeships, traineeships, internships and work experience for people from lower socio-economic backgrounds”.
Knock yourself out.
And no one has said that kids don’t have obstacles and face hardship. It’s just that on top of that, black kids have an extra thing to deal with.
Equal opportunity for people based on socio-economic diversity is one of the biggest issues in FTSE350 recruitment programmes at the moment. It’s a huge area with masses being done and there is a social mobility employers index published, which is a genuine ‘target’ for employers to do well in (annual reports focus on the issue in addition to other protected characteristics).
You are very out of date if you think it’s all about black kids. | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:56 - Jun 23 with 1412 views | londonlisa2001 |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:22 - Jun 23 by chad |
There you go with your absolutes,
I think a few women may disagree with you there Lisa, especially the sex and domestic slaves. And a few other abused girls. |
We are talking about discrimination based on colour.
The fact that different discriminations also exist is not relevant to the discussion.
Do try at least to keep up. | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 17:04 - Jun 23 with 1398 views | Arthur_from_OTB |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:22 - Jun 23 by NotLoyal |
Maybe you answered your own question, you actually recall the black woman, it’s not at all that you are racist it’s that you remember the situation compared to all the other people I’m sure you remember and helped throughout your life.
I think it’s a matter of truth that when we see a black person, or any other ethnic minority we immediately profile them unconsciously as what we see. We recall them as per their ethnic origin, which isn’t something we do to people of our own colour ( if you are white )
Although I doubt even the protestors know what they are shouting about if they had to explain it. |
You claim you know more about what black people are complaining about than they know themselves. Award yourself minus 100 virtue signalling points and surrender yourself to the thought police immediately. You need to be re-educated.
If you don’t know notice that white people are white you need to get your eyes tested. You are probably blind | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 17:13 - Jun 23 with 1389 views | jack247 |
| The plane over the Etihad on 14:45 - Jun 23 by Badlands |
That is vey naive.
White right terrorism is the fastest growing threat to public safety in the UK.
'Police said (2019) they and MI5, which since 2018 has taken the lead on the most serious extreme rightwing plots, were carrying out 80 investigations to stop violence fuelled by ideologies such as white supremacism and Islamophobia.'
Hitler didn't just pop up fully formed.
WLM is a response title to BLM set up by existing white supremacists in the US with links to groups in the UK (and other countries). |
The banner. The one those planks from Burnley flew over the Etihad. No need to overthink it. | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 17:16 - Jun 23 with 1384 views | NotLoyal |
| The plane over the Etihad on 17:04 - Jun 23 by Arthur_from_OTB |
You claim you know more about what black people are complaining about than they know themselves. Award yourself minus 100 virtue signalling points and surrender yourself to the thought police immediately. You need to be re-educated.
If you don’t know notice that white people are white you need to get your eyes tested. You are probably blind |
I have no political leaning or agenda. This is how I see it, if you don’t get it you don’t get it.
If you do you do.
Personally I couldn’t give a fck.
But your reply tells me numerous nerves have been touched. Leave the insults out of it though, that’s not a good place to go. | |
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| The plane over the Etihad on 17:41 - Jun 23 with 1333 views | chad |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:56 - Jun 23 by londonlisa2001 |
We are talking about discrimination based on colour.
The fact that different discriminations also exist is not relevant to the discussion.
Do try at least to keep up. |
Do at least try to remember what you post...
“All discrimination is wrong and abhorrent.
But inbuilt discrimination within the very structures of society are a totally different matter. No white person anywhere in the UK suffers that. The underdog is still the underdog wherever you may live in this country”
Perhaps under Lisalaw it is ok for you to widen the discussion so long as no one responds to disprove your point? At which point they are out of bounds
Gotcha, as I thought ;) Ever played the game of cups? | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 17:46 - Jun 23 with 1328 views | chad |
| The plane over the Etihad on 15:48 - Jun 23 by Sirjohnalot |
I accept this without reservation, it’s equally as disgusting and abhorrent. There’s always going to be exceptions that prove the rule, my point was as an overall picture, white people, being in the majority normally, do not suffer the same.
May I ask FJ if his awful experiences are limited to a small area as opposed to more widespread ? That’s the difference |
Sir J may I ask.
In the legal profession would it not be bad form to present generalisation and unknowns as absolutes, as you did initially? | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 18:01 - Jun 23 with 1304 views | londonlisa2001 |
| The plane over the Etihad on 17:41 - Jun 23 by chad |
Do at least try to remember what you post...
“All discrimination is wrong and abhorrent.
But inbuilt discrimination within the very structures of society are a totally different matter. No white person anywhere in the UK suffers that. The underdog is still the underdog wherever you may live in this country”
Perhaps under Lisalaw it is ok for you to widen the discussion so long as no one responds to disprove your point? At which point they are out of bounds
Gotcha, as I thought ;) Ever played the game of cups? |
We are talking about discrimination on grounds of colour. The whole thread is about discrimination on grounds of colour. It’s about someone flying a plane saying ‘white lives matter’ which sort of gives it away.
My use of the word ‘all’ was talking about all forms of discrimination on grounds of colour - it was a continuation of the point being made that some Asian people are discriminating against FieryJack in Bradford, Lohengrin drawing attention to it and also SirJohn responding. At no point was anyone talking about a different form of discrimination.
You will notice the description ‘white’ in my point ‘no white person ....suffers that’ - again, an indication that we are still talking about colour.
Chad, the ‘gotcha’ bit is as profoundly sad as it is wrong. It just makes you seem ridiculous. | | | |
| The plane over the Etihad on 18:38 - Jun 23 with 1261 views | Lohengrin |
| The plane over the Etihad on 16:53 - Jun 23 by londonlisa2001 |
University quotas:
University of Oxford Annual Admissions Report May 2020
“Those from the most deprived areas have increased from 8.6% to 12.2% and those from areas with low progressions rates to university from 10.8% to 14%.
In an effort to accelerate the pace of change, last year we announced three initiatives to help us to realize our ambition of ensuring that in four years’ time 25% of British undergraduates admitted to Oxford would be from low-income backgrounds. We increased the size of our UNIQ Summer School by 50%, to 1,350 students, last summer. The first cohort of students admitted via our Opportunity Oxford bridging programme will begin this September, and we will begin the roll-out of Foundation Oxford next year. It is too soon to see the impact of these initiatives on the figures presented here.“
Work Quotas:
“ Based on the review’s findings, the BBC’s Executive Board has accepted a range of recommendations that are designed to further increase the socio-economic diversity of the BBC workforce, and are looking into the viability of introducing a career mobility programme throughout the BBC to promote high performing talent. Other recommendations include:
Aiming to provide at least 70 percent of places on apprenticeships, traineeships, internships and work experience for people from lower socio-economic backgrounds”.
Knock yourself out.
And no one has said that kids don’t have obstacles and face hardship. It’s just that on top of that, black kids have an extra thing to deal with.
Equal opportunity for people based on socio-economic diversity is one of the biggest issues in FTSE350 recruitment programmes at the moment. It’s a huge area with masses being done and there is a social mobility employers index published, which is a genuine ‘target’ for employers to do well in (annual reports focus on the issue in addition to other protected characteristics).
You are very out of date if you think it’s all about black kids. |
Are you able to break that down by racial percentage? | |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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