| If Ukraine falls 09:28 - Nov 24 with 695 views | mangohilljack |
Are you ready for the consequences?
The West appears resolute in keeping Russia out, and the reasons are both apparent and troubling for those willing to look closer. Beneath the surface, there are deeply unsettling activities tied to the country's power players. Figures like the Biden crime family, the Clintons, the Bushes, and others seem to have vested interests—entangling their influence in ways that are far from innocent.
They will go to great lengths to conceal their secrets, employing any means necessary—even escalating to nuclear-level threats.
If Trump withdraws support—assuming events progress that far—you should brace yourself. The world as we know it will be irrevocably changed.
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| If Ukraine falls on 09:52 - Nov 24 with 646 views | controversial_jack |
There's no if about it, just a when. | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 10:06 - Nov 24 with 640 views | onehunglow |
| If Ukraine falls on 09:52 - Nov 24 by controversial_jack |
There's no if about it, just a when. |
Got the bunting ready then
It’ll be Xmas and New Year’s Day rolled into one | |
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| If Ukraine falls on 10:41 - Nov 24 with 611 views | sons_of_omri |
| If Ukraine falls on 10:06 - Nov 24 by onehunglow |
Got the bunting ready then
It’ll be Xmas and New Year’s Day rolled into one |
It will be. No more young Ukrainian lives ended short - those 500,000 are too late to save but the West hast to bear the blame for them. Those who facilitated Maidan must be sent to The Hague and tried. Victoria Nuland is chief suspect. | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 11:25 - Nov 24 with 580 views | Kilkennyjack |
| If Ukraine falls on 10:41 - Nov 24 by sons_of_omri |
It will be. No more young Ukrainian lives ended short - those 500,000 are too late to save but the West hast to bear the blame for them. Those who facilitated Maidan must be sent to The Hague and tried. Victoria Nuland is chief suspect. |
Such a waste of life.
Our idiot Johnson over there telling them not to settle but to fight a war they could not win. Then he went back to being a journalist. The West does bear blame you are right.
As always with wars get it settled before it starts for everyones sake.
Thats the real test of statesmanship.
I know its not always possible but you have to try.
Putin will be gone in 15 years so you can revisit things then. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| If Ukraine falls on 11:52 - Nov 24 with 552 views | controversial_jack |
| If Ukraine falls on 10:41 - Nov 24 by sons_of_omri |
It will be. No more young Ukrainian lives ended short - those 500,000 are too late to save but the West hast to bear the blame for them. Those who facilitated Maidan must be sent to The Hague and tried. Victoria Nuland is chief suspect. |
Yes, spot on! Someone who gets the big picture at last. | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 12:17 - Nov 24 with 536 views | AnotherJohn |
| If Ukraine falls on 11:25 - Nov 24 by Kilkennyjack |
Such a waste of life.
Our idiot Johnson over there telling them not to settle but to fight a war they could not win. Then he went back to being a journalist. The West does bear blame you are right.
As always with wars get it settled before it starts for everyones sake.
Thats the real test of statesmanship.
I know its not always possible but you have to try.
Putin will be gone in 15 years so you can revisit things then. |
In 15 years it would be too late for those on Putin's kill list, and beyond that Russia would not stop at the western Ukrainian border.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60472889
The scary thing is that Putin would probably be able to take what is left of the Ukrainian armed forces under his control in the event of total victory. By then the latter would be far less positive about allies who gave security guarantees that proved worthless.
Actually, I do not believe that Putin can take the whole of Ukraine. Russia has suffered huge economic damage and a level of casualties that the society at large still does not fully appreciate. | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 12:26 - Nov 24 with 524 views | controversial_jack |
| If Ukraine falls on 12:17 - Nov 24 by AnotherJohn |
In 15 years it would be too late for those on Putin's kill list, and beyond that Russia would not stop at the western Ukrainian border.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60472889
The scary thing is that Putin would probably be able to take what is left of the Ukrainian armed forces under his control in the event of total victory. By then the latter would be far less positive about allies who gave security guarantees that proved worthless.
Actually, I do not believe that Putin can take the whole of Ukraine. Russia has suffered huge economic damage and a level of casualties that the society at large still does not fully appreciate. |
They don't need to take it all. Take Kyev, oust the current regime and it's game over. The Ukraine will become a buffer zone, it's military threat with it's neo nazi units negated, the ethnic Russians in the east can have freedom and peace again and NATO going off with in embarrassment. | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 13:55 - Nov 24 with 475 views | Gwyn737 |
Agreed.
Russia’s GDP spend is going to have significant consequences down the road. It it carries on for another couple of years it will be catastrophic. | | | |
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| If Ukraine falls on 14:16 - Nov 24 with 463 views | onehunglow |
If Ukraine falls,Putin will use that success for justification for taking back former territories they stole . Starting with the Baltic states .
And we have people on this forum supporting them
It’s sick | |
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| If Ukraine falls on 17:33 - Nov 24 with 400 views | Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
| If Ukraine falls on 10:41 - Nov 24 by sons_of_omri |
It will be. No more young Ukrainian lives ended short - those 500,000 are too late to save but the West hast to bear the blame for them. Those who facilitated Maidan must be sent to The Hague and tried. Victoria Nuland is chief suspect. |
Why should the west take the blame for these deaths? Is there any thought behind that insanely stupid assertion? |  |
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| If Ukraine falls on 17:42 - Nov 24 with 393 views | onehunglow |
| If Ukraine falls on 17:33 - Nov 24 by Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
Why should the west take the blame for these deaths? Is there any thought behind that insanely stupid assertion? |
It’s the wests fault
Om and Contro live in the west
Why live somewhere you hate
Putin has got trump into the White House which could kill off Ukraine .
Others will follow | |
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| If Ukraine falls on 07:54 - Nov 25 with 269 views | felixstowe_jack |
| If Ukraine falls on 11:25 - Nov 24 by Kilkennyjack |
Such a waste of life.
Our idiot Johnson over there telling them not to settle but to fight a war they could not win. Then he went back to being a journalist. The West does bear blame you are right.
As always with wars get it settled before it starts for everyones sake.
Thats the real test of statesmanship.
I know its not always possible but you have to try.
Putin will be gone in 15 years so you can revisit things then. |
The only person responsible for the 100,000s of Russian and Ukrainian deaths is Putin. | |
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| If Ukraine falls on 07:56 - Nov 25 with 265 views | felixstowe_jack |
| If Ukraine falls on 12:26 - Nov 24 by controversial_jack |
They don't need to take it all. Take Kyev, oust the current regime and it's game over. The Ukraine will become a buffer zone, it's military threat with it's neo nazi units negated, the ethnic Russians in the east can have freedom and peace again and NATO going off with in embarrassment. |
They tried to capture Kyev in the first month of the war and failed. I suppose Putin could carry on targeting civilians. | |
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| If Ukraine falls on 08:22 - Nov 25 with 235 views | SullutaCreturned |
| If Ukraine falls on 17:33 - Nov 24 by Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
Why should the west take the blame for these deaths? Is there any thought behind that insanely stupid assertion? |
The West gave Putin the excuse when the EU was expanding towards Russia and NATO was couting former Soviet states.
Not that it justifies Putin but it's the same old story, politicians cause the trouble and the ordinary people pay the price. | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 08:33 - Nov 25 with 230 views | AnotherJohn |
| If Ukraine falls on 08:22 - Nov 25 by SullutaCreturned |
The West gave Putin the excuse when the EU was expanding towards Russia and NATO was couting former Soviet states.
Not that it justifies Putin but it's the same old story, politicians cause the trouble and the ordinary people pay the price. |
Swallowed some Kremlin propaganda there I'm afraid. Rumours that James Baker or Hans-Dietrich Genscher may have told Gorbachev off the record that NATO would not expand after German unification don't trump the right of eastern countries to make their own decisions about their future.
https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/115204.htm#:~:text=The%20myth%20that%20there% | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 08:55 - Nov 25 with 219 views | controversial_jack |
| If Ukraine falls on 07:56 - Nov 25 by felixstowe_jack |
They tried to capture Kyev in the first month of the war and failed. I suppose Putin could carry on targeting civilians. |
No they didn't. They sent a relatively small force there, to get Zelensky to the negotiating table. It worked until Johnson under Bidens instructions went there and told Zelensky to fight on. There was no realistic chance of taking Kyev with 30k troops | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 10:19 - Nov 25 with 187 views | felixstowe_jack |
| If Ukraine falls on 08:55 - Nov 25 by controversial_jack |
No they didn't. They sent a relatively small force there, to get Zelensky to the negotiating table. It worked until Johnson under Bidens instructions went there and told Zelensky to fight on. There was no realistic chance of taking Kyev with 30k troops |
They sent a huge force to capture Kyev including all their special forces which captured Kyev's air bases. Unfortunately they did not expect any resistance and when they reached the outskirts only 24 km from the centre they suffered very heavy tank losses. They Russians were so confident they did not support the tanks with soldiers, artillery or air cover.
They made a hasty confused retreat all the way back to Belarus with heavy tank casualties, abandoned tanks and equipment due to lack of fuel.
The special forces had to surrender due to no support. The Russian Generals in charge of this disaster were sacked. | |
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| If Ukraine falls on 10:29 - Nov 25 with 177 views | raynor94 |
| If Ukraine falls on 08:55 - Nov 25 by controversial_jack |
No they didn't. They sent a relatively small force there, to get Zelensky to the negotiating table. It worked until Johnson under Bidens instructions went there and told Zelensky to fight on. There was no realistic chance of taking Kyev with 30k troops |
That first sentence is right up there with your fantasy island posts, Putin honestly thought he could take Kiev, but was thourghly humiliated. |  |
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| If Ukraine falls on 11:38 - Nov 25 with 150 views | controversial_jack |
| If Ukraine falls on 10:19 - Nov 25 by felixstowe_jack |
They sent a huge force to capture Kyev including all their special forces which captured Kyev's air bases. Unfortunately they did not expect any resistance and when they reached the outskirts only 24 km from the centre they suffered very heavy tank losses. They Russians were so confident they did not support the tanks with soldiers, artillery or air cover.
They made a hasty confused retreat all the way back to Belarus with heavy tank casualties, abandoned tanks and equipment due to lack of fuel.
The special forces had to surrender due to no support. The Russian Generals in charge of this disaster were sacked. |
I think they sent about 30k troops at most. Not going to do much with that. They did tie down 100k Ukrainians before they retreated to allow forces to move in the Donbass, where they have remained. It's common knowledge the Johnson told Zelensky to to negotiate , but to fight on. Nor sure why this hasn't filtered down to this forum | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 12:47 - Nov 25 with 122 views | Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
| If Ukraine falls on 08:22 - Nov 25 by SullutaCreturned |
The West gave Putin the excuse when the EU was expanding towards Russia and NATO was couting former Soviet states.
Not that it justifies Putin but it's the same old story, politicians cause the trouble and the ordinary people pay the price. |
The difference is sovereign nations are free to choose to apply to join and leave both the EU and NATO. In fact several countries have been turned down from joining the EU. It’s hardly an aggressive act of expansion.
I will also reiterate the cast iron fact that the only reason NATO exists and the only reason countries neighbouring Russia are so desperate to join is because of a long history of Russian aggression towards its neighbours. | |
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| If Ukraine falls on 13:18 - Nov 25 with 102 views | controversial_jack |
| If Ukraine falls on 12:47 - Nov 25 by Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
The difference is sovereign nations are free to choose to apply to join and leave both the EU and NATO. In fact several countries have been turned down from joining the EU. It’s hardly an aggressive act of expansion.
I will also reiterate the cast iron fact that the only reason NATO exists and the only reason countries neighbouring Russia are so desperate to join is because of a long history of Russian aggression towards its neighbours. |
So, it would be ok for Russia to site weapons on Cuba pointed at Washington or Argentina to take over the Falklands or the Spanish to make claims to Gibrator and so on. It's nothing to do with right and wrong, it's realpolitik | | | |
| If Ukraine falls on 15:04 - Nov 25 with 75 views | SullutaCreturned |
| If Ukraine falls on 12:47 - Nov 25 by Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
The difference is sovereign nations are free to choose to apply to join and leave both the EU and NATO. In fact several countries have been turned down from joining the EU. It’s hardly an aggressive act of expansion.
I will also reiterate the cast iron fact that the only reason NATO exists and the only reason countries neighbouring Russia are so desperate to join is because of a long history of Russian aggression towards its neighbours. |
No, the difference is democratic countries might not like it but they wouldn't just invade the neighbour, they'd play silly political games to cause nonsense but they wouldn't go to war.
The countries the EU has turned down, wasn't that largely because they got nowhere near the Copenhagen criteria which is also a warning for the EUrophiles out there who think an indy Wales is an EU shoo in. | | | |
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