| Peterborough bid for Hogan 20:10 - Jan 7 with 51766 views | oddjob007 |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 07:40 - Jan 9 with 2716 views | Albert_Whitehurst |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 01:13 - Jan 9 by dingdangblue |
I really don't see the point of selling him so soon into his 1st pro contract. Whatever money Peterborough are offering - how much will he be worth if he puts Sheff Weds out of the cup, we draw a prem team in the 5th rnd and he scores against them, what if he ends up lge2 top scorer and gets us to Wembley? Its too soon to sell - for once in a lifetime the club needs to show some ambition. Do we really need the money now as opposed to at the end of the season? |
What if he breaks his leg against Hartlepool and his season is over?
If the 'deal' has hit a snag then there really is no firm deal in place.
Also, none of us know what Hilly has lined up for us in the January window at this point...he's pretty handy in the transfer market if I recall... [Post edited 9 Jan 2014 7:47]
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 07:43 - Jan 9 with 2706 views | ColDale |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 07:25 - Jan 9 by aleanddale |
Wow - This exploded overnight - obviously no smoke without fire.
For a change we hold the cards.... We dont know any facts and the vast majotity is speculation. One thing for sure Hogan is a bright young thing and he has 2 major defining assets.
1. Pace
2. He knows where the back of the net is
to buy 1+2 does not come cheap and i just hope the board hold out to get the VERY best deal that is available.
I am also sure if we had not sold Holt Lambert Murray ALF Buckley Perkins Done COG etc etc there is a strong chance we would now be lower not higher in the football pyramid.
evolution not revolution. Its what we need to do and it will not change even if we doubled our home support to 5000.
Lets see how this pans out and as before if Hill Dunphy and Hogan himself are happy with the deal we need to trust. |
I'd add 3) Age to your 1+2
The reason we haven't had silly money in the past is down to the age of the players. Dawson was the only one who was considered to be young. Had Holt, Murray, Lambert or Alfie all been 21 at the time of the transfer, the fee would have been much higher. (ignoring the clause in Holt's deal). |  | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 08:06 - Jan 9 with 2640 views | dingdangblue |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 06:12 - Jan 9 by ColDale |
Can only try and put myself into the head of Hilly on this.
Thanks to the Cup run, we are doing better than expected financially - not brilliantly, but enough for us to be able to make decisions for footballing reasons. This isn't like where we had to sell Alfie due to a tax bill, or when we had to sell Murray due to a series of postponements.
Hill will be given the final decision on this (we daren't risk doing anything else) and his thoughts will be, will this deal allow us to make the team a better team and help us in the long term?
If it happens, I'd expect an immediate return of Chris Dagnall as replacement with a sizeable amount of cash in the bank which will allow us to reinvest in the playing squad. It's quite possible that there is half an eye on putting together a competitive squad for League One. It should certainly allow a couple of signings for the remainder of this year (Daggers plus one other) and then significant funds in the budget for the next campaign.
If the deal's not a good one, then we say no. Simple as that.
BTW what ever happened to Kevin Townson? |
The problem is knowing what a good deal is after so few games? We've had sod all to sell since Hill left 1st time round (Grant aside) so I dont see the point in the board getting all giddy at the 1st chance of cashing in. We have been told we are in a decent state financially - Hogan is under contract - if he is going to be sold it should be in the close season after securing us promotion. |  |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 08:46 - Jan 9 with 2556 views | dalefan |
He should be sold if that is what is best for the club.
That can mean a lot of things.
If the money is really significant as we are being led to believe (700k) just think what hilly could do with some of that, it could mean the difference between getting promoted or missing out. We have to trust Hillys judgement.
We could invest some of it in other things, online ticketing etc. to boost future income.
We are NOT a one man team, reading some of the posts on here you would think we are which is insulting to the other players, we have done well without him this season, I have no reason to believe we can't for the rest of the season.
Don't get me wrong I would love him to stay, but if to sell him means the club would improve then so be it, but the deal has to be best for the club.
I trusty hilly and the board to get it right between them | | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 09:02 - Jan 9 with 2510 views | PaulH84 |
I think even if we sold Hogan we shouldn't be too insistant on an immediate replacement.
A lot of football agents and pundits have pointed to this summer being a very difficult one for an out of contract footballer.
I feel we have the depth in the squad (Cummins, George D, Joe Bunney) to sustain a promotion charge with or without Scott and we can bank this money to use for potential out of contract players to consolidate (hopefully) our league 1 position. | | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 09:04 - Jan 9 with 2504 views | Londondale |
There's a feeling of de ja vu here....but let's be honest. 700K if true would be a great deal for the club. It would be more than we got for Dawson and there is absolutely no chance we'd turn that down.
Also - We have survived and progressed having sold players in the past (Alf, Buckley, Murray etc etc) and having that much cash in the pot is a good thing. We're not a one man team and we can certianly find someone capable of bagging some goals with that kind of money.
Also - this is the entire point - financial stabiltiy is absolutely vital. buy a player for zero and sell him four months later for 700K? Absolutely. It's how our club is modelled - on devlopement. To suggest we should turn down an amount in that region or 'shouldn't sell at any price' is naive at best. At what price would those suggesting the above be willing to sell? 1 million? I have every faith that this money can be well invested into the club's infrastructure and that some of it (if we do sell) will be able to be spent on improving the team. We could probably have two additional strikers on the books with that kind of money.
It's not about not having ambition - it's about not ending up like Luton, Grimbsy, Darlo, Stockport, Chester, Halifax, Coventry or Portsmouth etc
there's a lower limit though - and if the figure is below 300K i'd be miffed! |  | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 09:31 - Jan 9 with 2435 views | dingdangblue |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 09:04 - Jan 9 by Londondale |
There's a feeling of de ja vu here....but let's be honest. 700K if true would be a great deal for the club. It would be more than we got for Dawson and there is absolutely no chance we'd turn that down.
Also - We have survived and progressed having sold players in the past (Alf, Buckley, Murray etc etc) and having that much cash in the pot is a good thing. We're not a one man team and we can certianly find someone capable of bagging some goals with that kind of money.
Also - this is the entire point - financial stabiltiy is absolutely vital. buy a player for zero and sell him four months later for 700K? Absolutely. It's how our club is modelled - on devlopement. To suggest we should turn down an amount in that region or 'shouldn't sell at any price' is naive at best. At what price would those suggesting the above be willing to sell? 1 million? I have every faith that this money can be well invested into the club's infrastructure and that some of it (if we do sell) will be able to be spent on improving the team. We could probably have two additional strikers on the books with that kind of money.
It's not about not having ambition - it's about not ending up like Luton, Grimbsy, Darlo, Stockport, Chester, Halifax, Coventry or Portsmouth etc
there's a lower limit though - and if the figure is below 300K i'd be miffed! |
But we are in the middle of a very successful season both in the cup and league. What message is it giving out if we sell our top scorer and best player (in my opinion) at the 1st sniff of interest. 700k is a massive amount but we don't need to sell now - I would take 700k anyday once this season is over. We can say no for once. The timing is awful. | |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:08 - Jan 9 with 2333 views | dingdangblue |
Another thing to think about is the interested club 'Peterborough' have a good recent history of spotting a 'bargain' striker and selling him themselves for millions - what is that telling us about Hogans value . I always remember after we sold Murray - a week later after he'd scored on his debut they were already doubling his value at there end. | |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:11 - Jan 9 with 2321 views | D_Alien |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 09:31 - Jan 9 by dingdangblue |
But we are in the middle of a very successful season both in the cup and league. What message is it giving out if we sell our top scorer and best player (in my opinion) at the 1st sniff of interest. 700k is a massive amount but we don't need to sell now - I would take 700k anyday once this season is over. We can say no for once. The timing is awful. |
Again, you're competely ignoring the key point made earlier about the motivation of the player. If his head's been turned (and I'm not saying it has) by a doubling or more of wages but we refuse to sell, do you think that's any good to Hilly or the rest of the squad?
Timing - its called the January window. There will have been moves made well in advance by buying clubs via agents to ascertain interest - it doesn't just crank up on the 1 January. So it won't be the 1st sniff of interest.
Message - what message do the 2000+ extra fans who turned up v. Leeds send to the club when they don't turn up for the bread and butter fixtures? "We're not going to support the club unless they're playing in a massively attractive fixture. Go on then, you're going to have to sell to survive, or fund the deficit out of your own pockets directors, so we can turn up and enjoy a game once or twice a year"
[Post edited 9 Jan 2014 10:15]
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:14 - Jan 9 with 2309 views | electricblue |
I would have thought the money made so far on the excellent cup with another round to play would enough not t warrant selling players..
Plus we have the chance to progress into round6 with a potential money maker to add a nice wedge to the existing coffers...
Whats the figure banded about so far £200k+ with more to come from round 5 aswell..
Surely Dale dont need to sell..
Wouldnt it be more prudent to keep hogan and keep the system and the momentum going on the pitch etc |  |
| My all time favourite Dale player Mr Lyndon Symmonds |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:32 - Jan 9 with 2227 views | dingdangblue |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:11 - Jan 9 by D_Alien |
Again, you're competely ignoring the key point made earlier about the motivation of the player. If his head's been turned (and I'm not saying it has) by a doubling or more of wages but we refuse to sell, do you think that's any good to Hilly or the rest of the squad?
Timing - its called the January window. There will have been moves made well in advance by buying clubs via agents to ascertain interest - it doesn't just crank up on the 1 January. So it won't be the 1st sniff of interest.
Message - what message do the 2000+ extra fans who turned up v. Leeds send to the club when they don't turn up for the bread and butter fixtures? "We're not going to support the club unless they're playing in a massively attractive fixture. Go on then, you're going to have to sell to survive, or fund the deficit out of your own pockets directors, so we can turn up and enjoy a game once or twice a year"
[Post edited 9 Jan 2014 10:15]
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I'm sure Hogan is ambitious and wants to get to the top, he is 6 months into his 1st pro contract though. He can double his wages in 6 months time when we sell him close season. As for timing - I know its the bleeding January window - Im more on about the timing of just having knocked Leeds out of the cup and the next round coming up in 2 wks - lets just knock the buzz out of the club by selling our top scorer eh? | |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:32 - Jan 9 with 2228 views | fitzochris |
I think this thread has reached a plateau until new and concrete info comes to light.
We all have our own views on this deal, but we are all speculating until we know:
- How much Posh are offering
- What sell-on clauses we are insisting on
- Whether or not Hogan wants to leave
- Whether or not Hilly has been forewarned and has a replacement lined up to immediately step in. |  |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:32 - Jan 9 with 2227 views | ColDale |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 08:06 - Jan 9 by dingdangblue |
The problem is knowing what a good deal is after so few games? We've had sod all to sell since Hill left 1st time round (Grant aside) so I dont see the point in the board getting all giddy at the 1st chance of cashing in. We have been told we are in a decent state financially - Hogan is under contract - if he is going to be sold it should be in the close season after securing us promotion. |
But would you not trust Hill to know what a good deal is? My point was that we have no need to sell unlike previously so any decision will be taken on whether it suits us as a club and Hill will have the veto on any deal. If the deal doesn't suit Keith, then Hogan stays. | | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:38 - Jan 9 with 2198 views | dingdangblue |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:32 - Jan 9 by ColDale |
But would you not trust Hill to know what a good deal is? My point was that we have no need to sell unlike previously so any decision will be taken on whether it suits us as a club and Hill will have the veto on any deal. If the deal doesn't suit Keith, then Hogan stays. |
Like Murray? Yes I trust Hilly to know what's best for the club . I would imagine he would want to keep Hogan till the season ends though. | |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:39 - Jan 9 with 2195 views | electricblue |
To put a negative spin on things..
Hill cant continuously find broken toys or a rough diamond its the law of averages..
I hope he does though find another gem perhaps a non league player that we know nothing of... | |
| My all time favourite Dale player Mr Lyndon Symmonds |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:52 - Jan 9 with 2127 views | Newbury_Dale |
I'd have expected some kind of update from the club by now on this TBH | | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:57 - Jan 9 with 2095 views | nordenblue |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:52 - Jan 9 by Newbury_Dale |
I'd have expected some kind of update from the club by now on this TBH |
Update about what speculation? Every time theres a sniff of interest for any of our players from any other club should the club release a statement? | | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:59 - Jan 9 with 2072 views | ColDale |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:38 - Jan 9 by dingdangblue |
Like Murray? Yes I trust Hilly to know what's best for the club . I would imagine he would want to keep Hogan till the season ends though. |
The Murray deal was out of Hill's hands. It was forced due to a series of postponements that Winter had left us broke. Was well documented that the deal was forced so we could pay the bills, hence
Much of the resentment towards everyone's favourite skrill north team. | | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 11:00 - Jan 9 with 2059 views | Newbury_Dale |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:57 - Jan 9 by nordenblue |
Update about what speculation? Every time theres a sniff of interest for any of our players from any other club should the club release a statement? |
If the audio interview is credible (and I've not listened to it), then assumption is that the club has already accepted the bid made by Posh. So it's gone beyond speculation now surely ? | | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 11:01 - Jan 9 with 2048 views | dingdangblue |
Nice to hear bigmouth Barry keeping his cards close to his chest. | |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 11:01 - Jan 9 with 2048 views | macro |
What sell on fee do Hyde have? |  | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 11:03 - Jan 9 with 2037 views | D_Alien |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 10:32 - Jan 9 by dingdangblue |
I'm sure Hogan is ambitious and wants to get to the top, he is 6 months into his 1st pro contract though. He can double his wages in 6 months time when we sell him close season. As for timing - I know its the bleeding January window - Im more on about the timing of just having knocked Leeds out of the cup and the next round coming up in 2 wks - lets just knock the buzz out of the club by selling our top scorer eh? |
Yes, I know you know its the January window!!
Is it the club's fault that offers start coming in just as we're into a cup run?
No.
Can they do anything to dissuade Hogan from leaving, even if the price is right?
Yes, and I'm sure that's exactly whats been happening since buying clubs first started to register interest - months ago I would imagine, not yesterday.
The chairman and Hilly weren't born then, either. Give them some credit and if the sale goes through, try to accept that its in the best interests of all concerned, not because they're a bunch of fools. | |
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| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 11:04 - Jan 9 with 2030 views | TalkingSutty |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 11:00 - Jan 9 by Newbury_Dale |
If the audio interview is credible (and I've not listened to it), then assumption is that the club has already accepted the bid made by Posh. So it's gone beyond speculation now surely ? |
Just listened to it and if it wasn't for Hogans agent the deal would have been done by now.
I think its safe to say that Hogan is on his way very soon, if we get a good fee with add ons then its good business. I trust Hilly to use some of the money to improve our chances of promotion. |  | | |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 11:05 - Jan 9 with 2016 views | ColDale |
| Peterborough bid for Hogan on 11:01 - Jan 9 by macro |
What sell on fee do Hyde have? |
as far as I am aware, none. He was playing without a contract at Hyde. | | | |
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